Approved Project Application: Antlers

Guillaaard

Herald
Hi everyone !

i'm applying for the Manor / countryhouse mini,
here is some photos, it's centered around a forest and hunting theme, with some rural agriculture aspects.

I hope theses rainy summer days are making all of you feel better in those hot weeks,
have a good evening,

-Guillard
 

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Renly_Baratheon_

Envoy
Pronouns
he/him
I was just looking at the dyna map and noticed that the plotted fields in Antlers are a lot bigger than the ones in the more recent crownlands projects (Gaunt, Harte, Mallery, Pyle and Duskendale). I don't know what the reason for the smaller size fields in these projects is but for cohesion sake I think it would make sense to accept it as a regional standard for new projects and potential updates in the crownlands.
 

Jakethesnake8_8

Firemage
Pronouns
he/him
I was just looking at the dyna map and noticed that the plotted fields in Antlers are a lot bigger than the ones in the more recent crownlands projects (Gaunt, Harte, Mallery, Pyle and Duskendale). I don't know what the reason for the smaller size fields in these projects is but for cohesion sake I think it would make sense to accept it as a regional standard for new projects and potential updates in the crownlands.
The fields are reasonably sized imo. I live in an area with a lot of fields and I can vouch for their vastness. Most likely fields are smaller in Duskendale in order to maximize space for a city sprawl. Field size isn’t really something that is important when it comes to cohesion, realistically you couldn’t use it as justification for say a mega build. Moreover, the size of fields may differentiate depending on the soil type. It’s conceivable that some crops seen elsewhere in the Crownlands don’t tolerate the soil at Antlers’ very well. Thus, they’d grow what they can and in large enough quantities to feed their people and sell the surplus.
 

starcat98

Envoy
Staff member
Generally I strive for a certain level of realism with the things I build and how I plot things, which is why I opted for larger fields like that. Fields in the Middle Ages, especially in medieval England which is where I draw most of my inspiration from, tend to be large strips of land covering extensive areas. This obviously varies depending on terrain, but in places like northern France and England where there are large, open areas, it would allow for such large fields. I personally think larger fields are more accurate and realistic, but to Jake's point I agree that field size doesn't necessarily matter when it comes to cohesion. A lot of our currently completed builds are separated by forests or otherwise have enough "filler" (hamlets, pastures, points of interest, etc.) that a change in the size of fields isn't as noticeable between projects.
 

Homiesucc

Envoy
Pronouns
she/her
Ive talked to starcat about antlers and I just want to discuss it a little more here, I think antlers, or at least the main town, has a problem of too many styles and too little consistency. aino's already said a lot about the unusual varner/reach influences but i just want to mention simply the overload of styles in antlers.

There's Grey stone, stormlands stone, sandstone, sandstone with dun, pure orange brick daub, orange brick daub with white daub, orange brick daub with brown daub, pure brown daub, pure white daub, sandstone and daub, grey brick and daub, all with and without stone caps on the sides. The only real consistency here is in the roofing materials.

I think the fact the crownlands is a very consistent region makes this problem even more emminent.

also on the other hand i do just want to say i love antlers championing the use of green pebbles in ground gradients. nice.
 
F

FD001__

Ive talked to starcat about antlers and I just want to discuss it a little more here, I think antlers, or at least the main town, has a problem of too many styles and too little consistency. aino's already said a lot about the unusual varner/reach influences but i just want to mention simply the overload of styles in antlers.

There's Grey stone, stormlands stone, sandstone, sandstone with dun, pure orange brick daub, orange brick daub with white daub, orange brick daub with brown daub, pure brown daub, pure white daub, sandstone and daub, grey brick and daub, all with and without stone caps on the sides. The only real consistency here is in the roofing materials.

I think the fact the crownlands is a very consistent region makes this problem even more emminent.

also on the other hand i do just want to say i love antlers championing the use of green pebbles in ground gradients. nice.
The varner thing is, that Jake's inspo was southern English towns afaik. It's more to me like Varner feels like it could be in the Crownlands, rather than Antlers feeling reachy.

I see the point about styles however - I don't think its that overbearing tbh.
 

starcat98

Envoy
Staff member
I'd like to preface this post by saying that I appreciate your feedback and your concerns are being heard. I have received additional feedback from other people, including one of my approving mods that I do plan to implement, though it will not drastically change anything, rather just clean and tidy some stuff up. Now to address the concerns you brought up:

First, Finn pretty much hit the nail on the head with his take. I would certainly be lying if I said I hadn't taken inspiration from Varner, but I don't believe that's necessarily unreasonable seeing as how it is the newest completed build on the server, and as mentioned, seemingly draws much of its inspiration from English towns (Jake, please correct me if I'm wrong), much in the same way that I have for Antlers. Varner certainly fits its northern Reach home, but at the same time it personally wouldn't strike me as out of place if I ran across it while taking a stroll through the Crownlands.

On to the style. I personally don't necessarily see what others see as a stylistic overload, but that also could just be a result of personal bias. When I constructed the warp platform and the build guide, I did three example builds and tried to write the guide as specific and in-depth as possible when it came to building. The inclusion of the purported "trouble blocks" I'll call them (Stormlands and sandstone blocks mainly) came about when some builders took creative liberties when building their houses, which I did in fact approve of and support in general. My reasoning in doing so was that a) it looked great, b) despite going outside of the "defined style" of the Crownlands and using blocks not included in the palette, it could reasonably be justified why such blocks would be present, and c) I am of the opinion that allowing builders creative freedom to think outside the box results in some of our best builds. Additionally, stormlands and sandstone blocks are used in Duskendale in conjunction with the dun blocks. As for the bricks, I have intended on using bricks/brick timber blocks in the palette since the beginning of the project years ago, and do have tests on my plot dating back that far. There are several brickworks scattered across the Crownlands and outside of the dun blocks, almost no builds constructed using said manufactured bricks (more on this later). I have a brickworks present on the southern end of the project, which would justify the local usage. In addition, when completed, Antlers will be almost entirely surrounded by thick forests, making it somewhat isolated in the northern Crownlands and allowing for some vernacular architecture to develop. When people built houses in the Middle Ages, they built them with what materials were available to them in the local area at the time (exceptions obviously for nobles and wealthy landowners). The idea is that the houses were constructed using materials the builder of the house could reasonably afford or obtain at that given time, be it brick or grey stone.

I disagree that the Crownlands has an established style, but only to a certain degree. Of the entire Crownlands, only four projects have been completed in recent years and in our most up to date quality: Pyle, Gaunt, Mallery, and Duskendale (Bullock being WIP). Of those projects, Antlers only borders one of them, Mallery. Outside of Maidenpool, the surrounding projects (Harte, Blount, and Cressey) are all older projects. While these projects do not look bad by any means, in my opinion, as we continue to improve our quality, some projects edge closer and closer to being classified as "outdated". That being said, while they share similarities with the other Crownlands projects, they also differ. Gathering an average of all the Crownlands projects, I feel it's safe to define the "Crownlands style" as follows: brown daub huts, grey stone castles, and dun mixed in for good measure. Applying that to some of the aforementioned projects, we can see that they check some of the boxes, but certainly not all of them. In a region with a solid mixture of older projects and newer, up-to-date projects, I feel that it is hard to actually define a consistent "Crownlands style", as there are some projects that use other blocks outside of that defined palette. Personally, I wish more bricks would be used in the Crownlands given not only the amount of brickworks present, but also the Crownlands' English inspiration.

On a final note, I have received a lot of positive feedback and compliments on how Antlers has developed so far, and relatively little in the way of criticism or things people would like changed. I appreciate all feedback whether it comes in the form of compliments or constructive criticism, because I think through this process our builds turn out the best they can possibly be. As builders though, I believe we have to walk a fine line between incorporating every bit of feedback that is given to us verbatim versus just doing so ad hoc (though it is important to mention blatantly ignoring feedback is not okay). I think we have and can continue to strike a happy medium between those two, and just understand and respect that we all have different tastes and creative differences in how we do things. Hopefully I answered any questions people might have and addressed some of the concerns that have been brought forward, and I implore people to continue to provide any feedback they might have for me!

Sorry for the essay :p

Thank you,
-Star
 

Jakethesnake8_8

Firemage
Pronouns
he/him
I'd like to preface this post by saying that I appreciate your feedback and your concerns are being heard. I have received additional feedback from other people, including one of my approving mods that I do plan to implement, though it will not drastically change anything, rather just clean and tidy some stuff up. Now to address the concerns you brought up:

First, Finn pretty much hit the nail on the head with his take. I would certainly be lying if I said I hadn't taken inspiration from Varner, but I don't believe that's necessarily unreasonable seeing as how it is the newest completed build on the server, and as mentioned, seemingly draws much of its inspiration from English towns (Jake, please correct me if I'm wrong), much in the same way that I have for Antlers. Varner certainly fits its northern Reach home, but at the same time it personally wouldn't strike me as out of place if I ran across it while taking a stroll through the Crownlands.

On to the style. I personally don't necessarily see what others see as a stylistic overload, but that also could just be a result of personal bias. When I constructed the warp platform and the build guide, I did three example builds and tried to write the guide as specific and in-depth as possible when it came to building. The inclusion of the purported "trouble blocks" I'll call them (Stormlands and sandstone blocks mainly) came about when some builders took creative liberties when building their houses, which I did in fact approve of and support in general. My reasoning in doing so was that a) it looked great, b) despite going outside of the "defined style" of the Crownlands and using blocks not included in the palette, it could reasonably be justified why such blocks would be present, and c) I am of the opinion that allowing builders creative freedom to think outside the box results in some of our best builds. Additionally, stormlands and sandstone blocks are used in Duskendale in conjunction with the dun blocks. As for the bricks, I have intended on using bricks/brick timber blocks in the palette since the beginning of the project years ago, and do have tests on my plot dating back that far. There are several brickworks scattered across the Crownlands and outside of the dun blocks, almost no builds constructed using said manufactured bricks (more on this later). I have a brickworks present on the southern end of the project, which would justify the local usage. In addition, when completed, Antlers will be almost entirely surrounded by thick forests, making it somewhat isolated in the northern Crownlands and allowing for some vernacular architecture to develop. When people built houses in the Middle Ages, they built them with what materials were available to them in the local area at the time (exceptions obviously for nobles and wealthy landowners). The idea is that the houses were constructed using materials the builder of the house could reasonably afford or obtain at that given time, be it brick or grey stone.

I disagree that the Crownlands has an established style, but only to a certain degree. Of the entire Crownlands, only four projects have been completed in recent years and in our most up to date quality: Pyle, Gaunt, Mallery, and Duskendale (Bullock being WIP). Of those projects, Antlers only borders one of them, Mallery. Outside of Maidenpool, the surrounding projects (Harte, Blount, and Cressey) are all older projects. While these projects do not look bad by any means, in my opinion, as we continue to improve our quality, some projects edge closer and closer to being classified as "outdated". That being said, while they share similarities with the other Crownlands projects, they also differ. Gathering an average of all the Crownlands projects, I feel it's safe to define the "Crownlands style" as follows: brown daub huts, grey stone castles, and dun mixed in for good measure. Applying that to some of the aforementioned projects, we can see that they check some of the boxes, but certainly not all of them. In a region with a solid mixture of older projects and newer, up-to-date projects, I feel that it is hard to actually define a consistent "Crownlands style", as there are some projects that use other blocks outside of that defined palette. Personally, I wish more bricks would be used in the Crownlands given not only the amount of brickworks present, but also the Crownlands' English inspiration.

On a final note, I have received a lot of positive feedback and compliments on how Antlers has developed so far, and relatively little in the way of criticism or things people would like changed. I appreciate all feedback whether it comes in the form of compliments or constructive criticism, because I think through this process our builds turn out the best they can possibly be. As builders though, I believe we have to walk a fine line between incorporating every bit of feedback that is given to us verbatim versus just doing so ad hoc (though it is important to mention blatantly ignoring feedback is not okay). I think we have and can continue to strike a happy medium between those two, and just understand and respect that we all have different tastes and creative differences in how we do things. Hopefully I answered any questions people might have and addressed some of the concerns that have been brought forward, and I implore people to continue to provide any feedback they might have for me!

Sorry for the essay :p

Thank you,
-Star
Right on the money, Star. Varner takes inspiration primarily from villages and towns in East Anglia, with some scattered French elements here and there. French and German elements are primarily seen in the castle, the septry, Belleglen and a few landmark buildings here and there.
 

AerioOndos

Donkey Lord
Staff member
Pronouns
they/them
Perhaps there could be some houses or settlements to the north to somewhat blend Antlers with the style of maidenpools agricultural areas? This could help reduce the walled garden effect that can be created by having forest enclosed projects and have the styles 'bleed' along the roads between projects. Same goes for Maidenpool lands houses in its far south.
 

Nikas Kunitz

Herald
I apply for the hamlet mini. Layout is already done and work on the houses just started. It includes bunch of low class peasant houses, 2 middle-low houses - the village elderman (the most well-doing family here) and the septon, 2 barns - one for general storage and another for cattle and sheep, and also a small wooden sept.
 

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AwbMan

Street Preacher
Guest
Hey this is Awb.

Just wanted to state I am applying for the Antlers HF hamlet mini! Here is a photo of progress so far
 

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