Completed Project Application: Durwell by an_escaped_duck

Thanks cash, but the responsibility is on me to finish the project and I won't have others doing work for me. I have been working on fixing what stoop and ark mentioned, but there are many unrealistic and not-sensible parts of the project that cannot be fixed just by changing minor things. I appreciate your offer but I must decline, I know you are busy with Wull and other things.
 

Emoticone11

The Dark Lord Sauron
Staff member
Hey Duck, I just want to point out that it's not at all unusual for builders to feel this way about their first project; the first project is typically where people learn the most about building and planning just through experience. It's good that you're realizing it while you're still doing the project, rather than months after you finish, and I'm glad you're willing to stick with it till the end.

I don't think you need to nuke everything and start over, though I also agree that you shouldn't limit yourself to just fixing the issues that were brought up, if you genuinely feel unsatisfied with the project so far. Instead of just stabbing in the dark, I would highly recommend trying to make a list of the specific things that are bothering you currently about the project, and then once you have those points down you can start trying to come up with feasible solutions (without limiting yourself by what already exists). Then you can decide how much work is actually necessary to make the project reach the standards that you desire it to be at.
 
Thanks emot, I guess I feel a bit better when you put it like that. I guess a lot of it centers around the organization of the lands, which short of nuking large sections cannot really be fixed. I will finish the project taking into account the feedbacks from above (and other things not listed above), and unless you would want me to make major changes, move on and apply the experience elsewhere. Thanks for providing some clarity on how I should proceed.
 

Emoticone11

The Dark Lord Sauron
Staff member
Glad I could be of help. I just want to clarify though, if you genuinely feel that significant reorganization of the land is necessary to make the project look the way you want it to look, you shouldn't feel discouraged from doing so. However, it's important to think about how specifically you can go about that goal (i.e. brainstorming plans), and then try to come up with estimates as to how much work it'd be, and whether or not you'd be willing to follow that work to completion or not.
 
Hi Ark and Stoop, here is a list of changes I have made to the project that address your feedbacks:

Durwell Castle:

-Added hay storage
-Added two pantrys
-Decreased ostentatious-ness (redid walls for less wealthy parts of castle)
-Added some supports
-Added dormers to roof
-Added overhangs to towers
-Added chimneys
-Added tower toppers
-Changed walls
-Added some brownish plaster to break up the daub


Brewery:
-Added some more natural things around it so its not so isolated

Farmstead 1:
-Added some plows
-Added some carts
-Added a trash heap
-Changed roof
-Added a treehouse
-Added a little wall
-Added more natural details


Hamlet 1:
-Added a small apiary
-Added lots of trees, bushes, rocks, flowers
-Added a trash heap
-Changed nearby pastures
-Changed windmills
-Added some carts and other details


Hamlet 3:
-Added some tents
-Added some carts
-Added lots of flowers, rocks, trees, bushes
-Added a little au-naturale orchard
-Changed some of the houses to wood
-Added a few more details


Hamlet 4:
-Added some small details
-Added lots of natural details
-Added a field being harvested nearby


Vassal 1:
-Added natural details

Lands in general:
-Changed animal shelters
-Added details here and there (campsites, broken carts, clotheswashing, etc)
-Made a new grass mix thats less boring
-Added trees, rocks, bushes, flowers throughout
-Changed pastures a bit
-Changed all the hedge borders to be less uniform and be wilder but also shorter
-Added some scarecrows
-Removed house tags and floating blocks


I definitely understand now what you guys mean by fleshing out the lands, I will be sure to keep this in mind for future projects! Thanks for taking a look!
 
Also thanks for the other feedbacks around the castle Iwan, and the other ones in the hamlet by the castle. Have you left anymore? I couldnt find any in a cursory flythrough. I fixed all the things you said except for the food storage and stables, which I would like to talk to you ingame about.
 

Iwan

Boldtown
I wanted to update you about the feedback here, but then I had to leave suddenly and came back too late last night. Sorry!
I've left quite a few around the castle, then made my way past durwellham3 and the brewery, where I left a few iirc.
 

Arkilstorm

Dowager Countess of Grantham
Staff member
Hey Duck, Ive taken a look around the castle and have some further feedback:

- Have you considered changing the roofing on the hoarding inside and outside the castle? The slate roof can be seen from beneath and looks a little strange. Perhaps use jungle roofing instead.

- The front facade of the castle still looks a little empty. Please consider adapting your gatehouse a little to make the wall a little less sparse.

- There is still oak paneling in the kitchen! It also doesn’t have a door into the corridor. This corridor doesn’t lead to any noble quarters or reception rooms, so I’m not sure why it’s so elegantly furnished.

- The pantry is nice, but you really need to add a proper food storage to your castle.

- THere’s a huge tapestry at the end of what looks like a servants hallway by some back-stairs. This certainly looks like an afterthought.

- Some of the upper rooms don’t have doors leading to servants or guards areas, so it gets a little confusing as to which rooms belong to whom.

- Your upstairs hallways have completely flat ceilings. These need rafters or vaulting.

- Your noble quarters on the upper-most floor have no doors at all. Some rooms have half doors in the doorways to frame them, others have nothing at all. Please keep a consistent style throughout, otherwise, it looks half-finished.

- The layout is also a little strange. There are some curved corridors that don’t make a lot of sense. Also please consider using a variation of materials. Every single room uses the oak paneling; it’s really boring after a while and makes the whole build seem a bit amateur.

- Have you made sure that every single fireplace is linked to the chimneys? It seems like too few chimneys for the number of fireplaces throughout the castle.

- Iwan has left you feedback on your barn outside the castle which corresponds with my own - Please take his advice into consideration also.

- The lands and farms are a lot better looking than they were originally, but the castle still looks massively out of place. There is no surrounding vegetation at the castle, only a handful of vines every now and then at the base. There needs to be some more work put into the immediate land around the castle.

I’m going to take a deeper look at some of the surrounding lands, but I want to be assured that you’re going to take this feedback on board. You did a lot of work to the lands following the feedback we gave last time, but the castle has remained practically unaltered.
 

Emoticone11

The Dark Lord Sauron
Staff member
Hey Duck, I've finished looking over the lands as part of my post-approval as well. I do think the changes you made to the surrounding lands have improved them a lot, the farmland all looks very nice. I agree with the points that Ark made about the castle. Here's a list of some more things that I noticed myself while flying through the project:

- The attic in the castle is unfinished.

- There's another small empty space in the right side of the gatehouse. At least just fill it in with stone.

- Many of the gradients (this applies to all stone castles/holdfasts in the build, including the main castle) are too messy, having random mixes of stone and frequently "light grey stone" and "light stone" next to each other without a "faint light grey stone" buffer block, which contrasts too much. For example, this holdfast:
https://puu.sh/yQVop/7deb93638d.png

I made an example of what it should look like (floating next to the holdfast, only the front side is changed) using only minimal changes. But it looks so much nicer:
https://puu.sh/yQVu3/c0ed5277d9.png

- I'm not sure of the well designs used in a couple places in Durwell:
https://puu.sh/yQrj5/c8487ec337.png
https://puu.sh/yQsc4/77416f79fa.png
https://puu.sh/yR3vh/6a0be1e5e0.png
They seem a little clunky imo. I'd recommend using the designs at /warp furnish instead.

- Many of the crops in the various hamlets and villages are un-grown, use bonemeal to make them into the fully grown variants. https://puu.sh/yQrHi/44661fabf6.png

- I'd recommend perhaps using wattle fence or something for the borders of the yards here, instead of stone. The stone seems unecessarily and looks a little awkward. Wattle fence might fit better with the surrounding land. Also, I'm wondering if there's anything you can do to make the two builds fit in more organically rather than being "seperate". https://puu.sh/yR4Kk/349a20a821.png

- Also, I still find the creek pictured in the image above rather strange. It's a very deep rut for being such a tiny stream. I would recommend just getting rid of the stream and keeping the tiny pond at the bottom.

- There are a few parts where the road is kind of lazily done, such as here:
https://puu.sh/yQs3A/d95f318a63.png
https://puu.sh/yQs5o/e6f4abfbfc.png
Please double check your lands for issues such as this and make sure everything looks fine from the perspective of someone walking along the roads.

- The dirt spots under the trees in the pastures and elsewhere are way too abrupt and plain, there needs to be some sort of transition. There are some examples of these in the animal pastures in White Harbor sprawl you can look at.

- I've come across some walls with exposed dirt and grass blocks underneath stone, like here:
https://puu.sh/yQUqJ/401530d08b.png
(This one is near farmstead1)


- I'd perhaps recommend raising this oak tree up a few blocks, it seems rather awkwardly low:
https://puu.sh/yQVGK/5582c87a0d.png
(near ham4)

- The pond near vassal1 could look a little less dead. There's a schembrush for this, BWater I believe.

- This melon patch in the town is pretty messy, and also not really what melon farms look like irl. Don't use the vanilla melon sprouts for them, just place the blocks.
https://puu.sh/yR3Hu/0f8480f0d3.png

- In the town, I'd recommend playing with the grass mix along the sides of the roads (for instance, using clusters of savanna grass here and there, having some more growth along the sides of houses), to make everything come together a bit smoother. Likewise, try to make the mud less patchy, and instead use it in larger blobs in the center of wide areas of dirt, or spots where mud would naturally form. There are plenty of examples of both of these, for instance in Wintertown, /warp sprawlvillage (yours would not be this muddy/overgrown), outside most of the KL gates, etc.
 
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Thanks Emot and Ark! I will address these over the next few days. Iwan I know you were also leaving some melons around, is there anything you would like to add to their feedback?
 

Enah

Skinchanger
hi duck, i wanted tgo point out to you there's a few "empty" sections inside the keep. mainly, the entire area beneath the stairs is not utilized and is wool/air, there's a couple spots of nothingness like that in the castle above i believe. please do not leave air bubbles as such, it will cause lag by rendering the space or so i have been told
 

Arkilstorm

Dowager Countess of Grantham
Staff member
Hi Duck,

I've had a look and the lands and hamlets seem to have all been addressed and are looking good. I still have some feedback about the castle, which hasn't been addressed yet:

- You’ve completely panelled the kitchen, which is the opposite of what we suggested you fix. The kitchen also has no windows. Really you should try and white-wash the room and fit a few windows for ventilation. The whitewash walls were designed to keep the room cool, and to bounce the light of the fire around the room, to help light it. Yours at the moment is the total opposite, of most kitchen ‘rules’ in medieval castles.

- The ceiling in one of the smaller bedrooms has huge rafters and looks a bit chunky, that can probably be left out.

- I really don’t understand what each room is, and find it really difficult to navigate the corridors in places. Rooms seem to be built almost at random in places, and the fact that you’re still using plaster/ paneling for 80% of the rooms, really doesn’t help denote which rooms are intended for which purpose. The castle is quite a big structure, with lots of space for lots of rooms, but they’re all the same height/ colour/similar contents, there’s no way of telling what’s going on half the time.

- You could really use some more thatch on the floor in places, the same brick pattern gets really repetitive and boring after a while.

- You still need a proper food store in your castle, with a granary. Your lone barn outside is useless in the event of a siege. The occupants of your castle would starve to death in days. Your castle has such high walls, and a small gate, and would put up quite a fight in a siege, but the whole ‘surviving’ during a siege, seems to be an afterthought. This would have been a fundamental part of the castle’s planning.

- The East side of the castle definitely could do with some buttresses, it looks a little strange with nothing supporting or surrounding the base.

Once these are seen to, give me a shout and I'll take one more look before post-approval. Thanks