Approved Project Application: House Conklyn by EarlNosyGarlic (JackPlaysX)
- Thread starter EarlNosyGarlic
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The Spring 2023 edition of The Rookery is now out! Take a look to see the latest builds, guides, progress and development updates on the upcoming 1.18.2 switch. You can read it here:
https://indd.adobe.com/view/f943da18-ed77-4d55-845d-fee9bfa14247
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Enah
Skinchanger
approved both javiv and pig's hamlets, sorry! i overlooked them during my april period of sadness
EStoop
Knight of Fairmarket
Hello,
I was exploring the map and came upon Brandybottom, which seems under construction. I noticed a couple of things, namely:
Brandybottom layout & economy
The town seems to be walled with a non defensive wall, but what is the function of this wall? Right now it looks like it is the sole reason for the tightly packed layout of the town/village (couldn't find a single mention of it being a town). This leads me to a follow up question; what is the reason for the dense layout of the settlement? There doesn't seem to be anything limiting the growth except for the wall, which wouldn't stop people from expanding outside of it since it doesn't serve a defensive function.
The village is also extremely wealthy, since over half of the residents live in a middle class house. The local septon even lives in a house that rivals that of the High Septon. How are these people so wealthy? There is no major trade route near it, no signs of a strong economy and the village itself isn't even that large.
The type of fruit bearing tree is all over the place. Having a couple different ones is fine, but there is no need to have every flavour. Especially not if they come in numbers of 5.
The use of profession signs is limited to towns and cities. People in a village this size would know where to find the baker, and other professions.
Style
The overall style of houses seems a little dated to me, which is mainly due to the roof shape. In order to make a curvy roof like the houses have, you actually have to put in more effort than at a normal roof, something I doubt medieval peasantry would do (not even in the apparantly primarily bourgeoisie demographic of the Reach).
The yards of the project, especially at Brandybottom, seem really cramped and are all surrounded by stone walls. Get some wattle in, some hedges or good old fence to make it seem less monotonous.
Possible solutions
That said, I really like the concept of the village, and I think that with a bit of effort and WE magic it could be turned into something really unique.
Have the village be focussed around a septry; it will allow you to have an expansive sept compared to the amount of houses present, gives oppertunity to some nice extra cloisters and whatnot and would give you a good excuse for the wall around the village. Move the buildings further away from eachother, giving the villagers more garden space for vegetables and animals. Surround it all with expansive orchards, some inside the village walls and some outside, and base the economy of the place on the production of brandy.
I'd get rid of the markethall, since the place really doesn't have the economic strength to justify such a thing. I'd (re)move some of the middle class houses to make the demographic buildup of the place more realistic.
I was exploring the map and came upon Brandybottom, which seems under construction. I noticed a couple of things, namely:
Brandybottom layout & economy
The town seems to be walled with a non defensive wall, but what is the function of this wall? Right now it looks like it is the sole reason for the tightly packed layout of the town/village (couldn't find a single mention of it being a town). This leads me to a follow up question; what is the reason for the dense layout of the settlement? There doesn't seem to be anything limiting the growth except for the wall, which wouldn't stop people from expanding outside of it since it doesn't serve a defensive function.
The village is also extremely wealthy, since over half of the residents live in a middle class house. The local septon even lives in a house that rivals that of the High Septon. How are these people so wealthy? There is no major trade route near it, no signs of a strong economy and the village itself isn't even that large.
The type of fruit bearing tree is all over the place. Having a couple different ones is fine, but there is no need to have every flavour. Especially not if they come in numbers of 5.
The use of profession signs is limited to towns and cities. People in a village this size would know where to find the baker, and other professions.
Style
The overall style of houses seems a little dated to me, which is mainly due to the roof shape. In order to make a curvy roof like the houses have, you actually have to put in more effort than at a normal roof, something I doubt medieval peasantry would do (not even in the apparantly primarily bourgeoisie demographic of the Reach).
The yards of the project, especially at Brandybottom, seem really cramped and are all surrounded by stone walls. Get some wattle in, some hedges or good old fence to make it seem less monotonous.
Possible solutions
That said, I really like the concept of the village, and I think that with a bit of effort and WE magic it could be turned into something really unique.
Have the village be focussed around a septry; it will allow you to have an expansive sept compared to the amount of houses present, gives oppertunity to some nice extra cloisters and whatnot and would give you a good excuse for the wall around the village. Move the buildings further away from eachother, giving the villagers more garden space for vegetables and animals. Surround it all with expansive orchards, some inside the village walls and some outside, and base the economy of the place on the production of brandy.
I'd get rid of the markethall, since the place really doesn't have the economic strength to justify such a thing. I'd (re)move some of the middle class houses to make the demographic buildup of the place more realistic.
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Clearly, I still have much to learn...
Thank you for your feedback Stoop!
From what I know, you're somewhat of a master of town building, so getting some advice and feedback from you is an honor for me :3 I'll go through your points and give my say in them.
The layout and economy.
The wall idea came from Bandallon town, as it also has a simmilar sort of wall, only mine was plotted with the entention of the whole settlment being in a circular or more of an oval like shape. I fully agree with your points about the unneccesary dense plotting due to the wall.
The point about it being a town; on the House Osgrey Wiki on the Awoiaf states that Dosk, Little Dosk and Brandybottom were towns once under the controll of House Osgrey under The Sworn Sword section:
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_Osgrey
While the individal Wikis for all the setltments state they are villages: https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Brandybottom
I tried making a compromise by trying to make it a sort of inbettween and signify that it's slowy expanding, but clearly it doesn't seem I succseded. That is also the reason why it's so wealthy, since I also added a market hall, I thought they'd be quite wealthy. The "septon's house" is a septry inside the settlment, I made the residents of the lands of House Conklyn and Brandybottom very religious, I made it so that the Faith has a very strong pressance all over the lands, especially in Bb. I am not agreeing with a removal of it, but a relocation is fine if that need be. No one gave me any feedback on the orchards I made, so I just sorta left how they are. Will remove some.
The Style
I'm using a small deversion of The Sworn Swords lands style and pallette made by Duck, which was made last year when he started House Durwell. Perhaps I can make an addition to the deversion I made for Conklyn to fix the roof problem.
A Solution
Your solution sounds lovely, I have doughts that I'll do it exactly as you though, but I'll try my best. Basically, if I compleatly understand what you mean: I should reduce the population of the village, especially the middle class, make the septry be the centre of the settlment with sparse houses arround it with large yards along with a smaller wall with orchards inside and or outside them. That's how I see it simplified. I'd need someone willing to lend their WEing skillz though, I have WE perms, but I'm quite inexperianced with terraforming.
Thank you again for your feedback and I promis to do my best to fix things up ~ <3
P.S. I'm willing to remove the market hall from Bb, but I'll be keeping it at my plot, perhaps someone could use it :3
-Jaqaboi (^J^)
Thank you for your feedback Stoop!
From what I know, you're somewhat of a master of town building, so getting some advice and feedback from you is an honor for me :3 I'll go through your points and give my say in them.
The layout and economy.
The wall idea came from Bandallon town, as it also has a simmilar sort of wall, only mine was plotted with the entention of the whole settlment being in a circular or more of an oval like shape. I fully agree with your points about the unneccesary dense plotting due to the wall.
The point about it being a town; on the House Osgrey Wiki on the Awoiaf states that Dosk, Little Dosk and Brandybottom were towns once under the controll of House Osgrey under The Sworn Sword section:
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_Osgrey
While the individal Wikis for all the setltments state they are villages: https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Brandybottom
I tried making a compromise by trying to make it a sort of inbettween and signify that it's slowy expanding, but clearly it doesn't seem I succseded. That is also the reason why it's so wealthy, since I also added a market hall, I thought they'd be quite wealthy. The "septon's house" is a septry inside the settlment, I made the residents of the lands of House Conklyn and Brandybottom very religious, I made it so that the Faith has a very strong pressance all over the lands, especially in Bb. I am not agreeing with a removal of it, but a relocation is fine if that need be. No one gave me any feedback on the orchards I made, so I just sorta left how they are. Will remove some.
The Style
I'm using a small deversion of The Sworn Swords lands style and pallette made by Duck, which was made last year when he started House Durwell. Perhaps I can make an addition to the deversion I made for Conklyn to fix the roof problem.
A Solution
Your solution sounds lovely, I have doughts that I'll do it exactly as you though, but I'll try my best. Basically, if I compleatly understand what you mean: I should reduce the population of the village, especially the middle class, make the septry be the centre of the settlment with sparse houses arround it with large yards along with a smaller wall with orchards inside and or outside them. That's how I see it simplified. I'd need someone willing to lend their WEing skillz though, I have WE perms, but I'm quite inexperianced with terraforming.
Thank you again for your feedback and I promis to do my best to fix things up ~ <3
P.S. I'm willing to remove the market hall from Bb, but I'll be keeping it at my plot, perhaps someone could use it :3
-Jaqaboi (^J^)
EStoop
Knight of Fairmarket
I'd be more than happy to help you ingame. I'm usually on in the weekend.
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Enah
Skinchanger
When the game works right, we'll have a meet up and see what can be done to make it better! I know you got the potential jaq! and with stoop's guidance... mwuahahahahahahahahhaha
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Heyoo!
I fully intend on completing Conklyn as soon as I am able to. I have recently started gymnasium (as in back in September) and I haven't found that much time for leisure as I may have before. Along with that, I've been having a few problems with my PC which has affected my gaming as well.
Know that I am very much still active on Westeroscraft (I check the map every so often, things seem to be progressing greatly!) and that I'll make my grand return as soon as I possibly can
See you all soon!~
-Jaq
I fully intend on completing Conklyn as soon as I am able to. I have recently started gymnasium (as in back in September) and I haven't found that much time for leisure as I may have before. Along with that, I've been having a few problems with my PC which has affected my gaming as well.
Know that I am very much still active on Westeroscraft (I check the map every so often, things seem to be progressing greatly!) and that I'll make my grand return as soon as I possibly can
See you all soon!~
-Jaq
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EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Hey lads.
Conklyn's back under construction. Will be on the server more and will finish it.
By the by, what year is it?
(also I'm called EarlNosyGarlic now, just so y'all know)
Hey lads.
Conklyn's back under construction. Will be on the server more and will finish it.
By the by, what year is it?
(also I'm called EarlNosyGarlic now, just so y'all know)
- Pronouns
- she/her
Can you provide a bit of an update of what your plans are on here before you really get started building things again?
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Rightio!
First things first: I've been thinking about it a lot and have decided to redo Brandybottom in its entirety. I'll make it much smaller than it is right now and incorporate the planned septry and winery into it (as proposed by stoop way back when; the little floating build above BB is his).
Second: Relearn terraforming and such so I can do the fields and forests by myself (which seem fine, but I'm no expert on composition. I could use a second opinion on them).
Third: Ehhh I suppose that's about it really, the rest will be mostly the same as far as I see it. I don't know if I need to update anything that's been built (besides BB) unless there has been a style change or if it looks outdated.
It's great to be back, the server has progressed loads since I was there last (besides today)! I hope to finish this project this year
First things first: I've been thinking about it a lot and have decided to redo Brandybottom in its entirety. I'll make it much smaller than it is right now and incorporate the planned septry and winery into it (as proposed by stoop way back when; the little floating build above BB is his).
Second: Relearn terraforming and such so I can do the fields and forests by myself (which seem fine, but I'm no expert on composition. I could use a second opinion on them).
Third: Ehhh I suppose that's about it really, the rest will be mostly the same as far as I see it. I don't know if I need to update anything that's been built (besides BB) unless there has been a style change or if it looks outdated.
It's great to be back, the server has progressed loads since I was there last (besides today)! I hope to finish this project this year
Margaery_Tyrell
The Dark Lord Sauron
I can help with stuff if you need me to, im ok at making fields and forests
- Pronouns
- they/them
Enah
Skinchanger
she is OK, she is average. you cannot let the AI get big motherboards, lest we have a Third Computer Revolt on our hands.
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
Alright lads, listen up!
I have a proposal regarding Brandybottom (henceforth shortened to BB) and its surrounding lands. Previously, the village had excluded the winery, but now it has been combined with the septry (which will now be around the sept itself) into a bigger septry complex. The basis for this change is that septons would be the ones who would prepare wine and brandy (assuming brandy does exist in Westeros). As such, the south of the Conklyn lands shall be a large forest which contains an already built lumberjack hamlet.
The fields on that side (essentaily west Brandybottom) will have orchards like in the south-east (Update: this inculdes stuff like apples, apricots, cherries and other such stone fruits) and vinyards in the south (labled as grapes n such in pruple). The southern part shall have winery/vinyard workers that fall under the low class (that will generaly be the area where the current old septry lays). The north-eastern fields shall have corps like wheat and barley and whatnot.
The yellow part includes the area for all the middle class and middle/low class residents. The number of these houses will stay in around 5 houses total (let's say 2 middle class and then 3 middle/low class so that we don't have too many of them). The 2 mid classes shall make up the wealthies of traders in the village, which shall include a wine merchant and a smith. The 3 middle/low class will be say a baker, a butcher and a cartwright. The Inn is considered among the middle class structures, yet is outside of the middle class cluster. It shall lay in the south-western part.
The brown part is the sort of village proper. This includes the middle class and low class residents. Those will mostly be farmers, but shall included simple professions for each little cluster.
Swanky new map ^
The way I invision the layout of the houses and their yards is that we have houses around the centre (currently occupied by the market hall, which will be removed and replaced with like a well or something to act as a ground for merchants to set up their stalls) followed by their yards, then another set of yards that connect to other houses. Shall we say the first set of houses and yards are the inner houses while the other sets are the outer houses. None of these aformantioned exceed the areas circled in brown, though there will be some along the roads (naturally). I hope this explination makes sense as I do have a little model that I made, but it doesn't want to upload it here (shall try and make another post with the model in it).
That would be more or less all for BB. I hope the above makes sense... yeah.
I have a proposal regarding Brandybottom (henceforth shortened to BB) and its surrounding lands. Previously, the village had excluded the winery, but now it has been combined with the septry (which will now be around the sept itself) into a bigger septry complex. The basis for this change is that septons would be the ones who would prepare wine and brandy (assuming brandy does exist in Westeros). As such, the south of the Conklyn lands shall be a large forest which contains an already built lumberjack hamlet.
The fields on that side (essentaily west Brandybottom) will have orchards like in the south-east (Update: this inculdes stuff like apples, apricots, cherries and other such stone fruits) and vinyards in the south (labled as grapes n such in pruple). The southern part shall have winery/vinyard workers that fall under the low class (that will generaly be the area where the current old septry lays). The north-eastern fields shall have corps like wheat and barley and whatnot.
The yellow part includes the area for all the middle class and middle/low class residents. The number of these houses will stay in around 5 houses total (let's say 2 middle class and then 3 middle/low class so that we don't have too many of them). The 2 mid classes shall make up the wealthies of traders in the village, which shall include a wine merchant and a smith. The 3 middle/low class will be say a baker, a butcher and a cartwright. The Inn is considered among the middle class structures, yet is outside of the middle class cluster. It shall lay in the south-western part.
The brown part is the sort of village proper. This includes the middle class and low class residents. Those will mostly be farmers, but shall included simple professions for each little cluster.
Swanky new map ^
The way I invision the layout of the houses and their yards is that we have houses around the centre (currently occupied by the market hall, which will be removed and replaced with like a well or something to act as a ground for merchants to set up their stalls) followed by their yards, then another set of yards that connect to other houses. Shall we say the first set of houses and yards are the inner houses while the other sets are the outer houses. None of these aformantioned exceed the areas circled in brown, though there will be some along the roads (naturally). I hope this explination makes sense as I do have a little model that I made, but it doesn't want to upload it here (shall try and make another post with the model in it).
That would be more or less all for BB. I hope the above makes sense... yeah.
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EarlNosyGarlic
Faith Militant
