Completed Summerhall - Cash

[CashBanks]

Here it is, I'm sure there's some areas that could be polished and refined with some second opinions, so let's treat this as the start of the conversation.



Thanks to Ark, Enah, Emote and Iwan for the help so far.

Thanks

 

[Elduwin]

As there are still some unfixed stuff at Wull, and as it is not post approved, I'm in the obligation to delay this application until Wull is fully complete and post approved, adding the classic 1 week wait after post approval.
Hope you'll understand.

 

[CashBanks]

No rush!

 

[AerioOndos]

I suggest looking at some of the Images for destroyed malbork in 1945
They should be useful for looking at the damage fire fire has done to similar structures. However, it can be partially discounted as much of the damage has been done by explosives and rather than conflagration

 

[nubcaker]

Wow, this is definitely one of the best apps I've ever seen. And I love that you used Coudenberg palace as inspiration. Its destruction is one of the biggest historical losses for Belgium, and for western Europe in general. Though it's pretty fitting that it was also destroyed in a fire. I'm only a nobuild, but I'm very excited to see this app come to fruition.

 

[DylanLovesYouJP]

Nice Benson profile pic.

 

[EStoop]

A lot of the inspiration (or at least the pictures you used) are not a representation of how the locations looked during medieval times.

• Malbork castle is a legit example of a late medieval castle. However, it's function was not that of a noble residence, but as stronghold for a monastic military order made to house hundreds of knights and soldiers.
• Windsor castle has a lot more than "a few post-gothic renaissance expansions". Most of the castle's apartments seen in the pictures have been build after the middle ages or even the renaissance. However, st. George's chapel is an exception to this (which is very late medieval).
• Coudenburg castle shown in the pictures and reconstruction has vast parts of the building which are not medieval. The only medieval part of the castle in the pictures is the Aula Magna (the tall structure with corner towers, best visible in the reconstruction) build at the end of the medieval period in 1452-1460.
• Palais de la Cité, however, is a legit example of a medieval royal residence.
• Arundel castle has been expanded in the 16th and 18th centuries, which made it look the way it does in your reference pictures.
• Lancaster castle has a couple of medieval elements, but not those portrayed in the pictures of your application (except the norman keep hiding behind "modern" additions and the structures mentioned in the app).
• Old Westminster Palace didn't look the way it is portrayed in the pictures during (most of) the middle ages. This website shows the growth of the palace.
• Heidelberg castle is, as you mentioned, way out of our timescope.
• Kenilworth castle is mostly within our timeframe.

I think that the rather modern nature of the source material has resulted in a too modern rendition of Summerhall.

I'd like to point you towards more accurate inspiration, but at the moment I lack the time and will do so later this week. At the moment all I can point you to is the castles portrayed in the "Très Riches Heures du Duc de Berry" and the german castle type Kaiserpfalz (castles that served as an imperial residence).

Edit | Fixed German words

 

[Iwan]

Kaiserpaltz

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaiserpfalz

 

[Enah]

I actually mentioned the Kaiserpfalz to howy when he was interested in it and not but 2 weeks ago to cash. I still say to make an actual castle that's very nice inside, with more windows or something but it must needs still be a proper castle. I'm sure that having a more or less "fairytale" castle would suffice to Grrm's vision. I very much agree with looking through the Tres Riches Heures, it is the right end of the time period that we've got for much of the "advanced" areas of Westeros, and I am sure you can piece together a more compact and fitting castle while still incorporating elements of your style thus far

 

[EStoop]

So I did some research, and it seems that finding castles that have functioned as hunting lodges is really hard.

Since I do not want to dedicate too much time to this, I recommend looking through the pages of the various English and French kings, Holy Roman Emperors and dukes of Burgundy and look for the castles they were born in and died in, as well as castles that are mentioned as being favoured by them or have been used as a hunting lodge.

Just a heads up that the medieval period lasted up untill roughly the middle of the 15th century.

 

[CashBanks]

Thanks for everyone's thoughts so far. I'm more or less happy with the aesthetic/structural features but ruminating on the layout and floor plan. As I mentioned in the app I think all Targaryen architecture is going to be incongruous with real life historical inspiration to an extent, and to meet the key points of GRRM's descriptions we need to explore options beyond 1:1 replicas of existing castles. Don't get me wrong, I'm hearing your points about medieval authenticity, but marrying that with the canon is going to be a process.

 

[Hgkoolaid]

Hey Cash! Love the app and just want to say as the head of Musgood I'd love to work with you on all of this including the Foster to make this awesome! We can chat about it in game or on discord if you want! I'm committed to the Marches being amazing haha

 

[CashBanks]

Awesome KoolAid, glad you're still interested in finishing the project. Finishing off the Marches and moors will be a bit of a process as the whole area could do with a refresh. I'm not sure if we'll be getting any new block types to help with that, perhaps @Emotione11 and @carci can weigh in when they have a chance.

 

[AerioOndos]

Freshening that area up would be good, especially as it would help blend with Wyl

 

[Emoticone11]

I am planning to add a couple blocks which should hopefully help with moor/plain type environments, yes. I want to make a bit more progress on WH before I start to work on that though.

 

[Hgkoolaid]

Since that is the case I am okay with holding off on making any big advancements on Musgood until that is completed. If you need any help finishing up WH @Emotione11 I'm your man

 

[Emoticone11]

Surely there's some advancements you can make on Musgood until then? The blocks I'm talking about should only affect the final terraforming stuff. I'll let you know if I need anything at WH!

 

[Hgkoolaid]

I will go ahead with the plotting for the main village that's for sure. My main concern is the initial plans for Musgood involved more wooded areas that would be missing now with these plans so that kind of changes things up a bit so I may need to re-evaluate the surrounding lands

 

[CashBanks]

Update
I went back to the drawing board with the castle, with some tips from Ark and Carci I've redesigned the style of the exterior to be less baroque (the new style is hopefully more akin to Lancaster castle) and the layout/towers have cut the Coudenberg inspiration for something closer to Heidelberg ~1500s.

Here's the Updated Application doc, the changes start from page 16.

I thought it would be helpful to also show the extent to which I'd expect the structure to be damaged by fire, which will obscure a lot of the finer details. The gif below is the same corner of the castle in the 3 degrees of destruction.

My hope is that there's enough merit in these tests to get provisional approval from two mods who I can then discuss any further refinements with. Summerhall's a project that sparks a lot of opinions and it would be helpful to avoid having it get stuck in limbo while it's designed by committee (though I do appreciate the suggestions and want this to be something that befits the hype).

<3, $$$

 

[thecoddfish]

You have my provisional approval - I really enjoy the tests, and I think you have made a great application. I must admit your plan to tackle the Dornish Marches is bold, but if you think you can commit to it then I would be happy to see it done too.