Gulltown Redo Discussion Megathread

Emotione11

Maester
I'd still be interested in helping with this, if/when it starts moving onto our agenda, and if I have a little bit more free time on my hands by then. It would be great to get a cohesive style going (terraforming as well) between Wickenden, Ruthermont, and Redfort, and then up to the peninsula with Gulltown and Runestone.

My idea as far as style is concerned is essentially continuing with the Germanic/Swiss style, but possibly adding some varied types of daub/wattle as it transitions to the Gulltown sprawl & urban area. Kind of along the lines of Rothenburg ob der Tauber but a bit more muted and nautical.
 
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CashBanks

Maester
I agree a German/Swiss style would be really charming. I've been thinking about what sort of architectural features might help define the city (in the same way White Harbor has the Nordic peaked style roofline).

One idea I had was this "half hip" aka "krüppelwalmdach" (I think) style of roof.
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The in-game results are a little meh, not sure if it really cuts an interesting profile.

But Tham's blue daub though - *chef's kiss*
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AerioOndos

Builder
the far right insp images would be very good for the lands outside of the city and any small communities nearby. The hips will be difficult to achieve on smaller buildings though.
 

EStoop

Builder
I did some minor research and found the cities of Luzerne, Plymouth and Nagasaki to be a nice inspiration for a variety of reasons. Obviously the reason for me to include Nagasaki is not stylewise but rather geographical.

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The town walls of Luzerne are especially nice, here are some pics of it from my visit to the city last winter.

I think a germanic style for the city would fit well, although I am personally not a fan of the minecraft translation of the half-hipped roofs.

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CashBanks

Maester
Those look really good and Lucerne in particular would be great for city walls inspiration. Genoa struck me as a interesting as well, at least in terms of layout since it was a major trading port on a natural harbour, and it wasn't framed around a major river (the Vale maps don't seem to indicate any big ones flowed in the GT area).

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The test model I put together at /warp gttest was inspired by the sketches of Genoa above, though I'm mostly just jazzed by how it sort of looks like a seagull from the air.


I won’t die on a hill for any of these tests, It was morbid curiosity that motivated me to do them, when I get an idea I usually have to follow through on it to get it off my mind.
 

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Enah

Builder
I know, it's so unfair he can go to these places. I'd be afraid of Gulltown being too much like White Harbor. That layout seems too similar, imo
Also, you should scatter manses/middle/poor across the city, the richest nearer the docks and castle with the middle/lower all over and the poorest outside the city proper being farmers and peasants.
 

otty

Builder
I did some minor research and found the cities of Luzerne, Plymouth and Nagasaki to be a nice inspiration for a variety of reasons. Obviously the reason for me to include Nagasaki is not stylewise but rather geographical.
So while I understand this was just a reference towards topography and function. This would be just a suggestion, but it would be interesting to see the isolationist island Dejima, where Dutch and Chinese ships were allowed to port for much of the seclusion. While it doesn't have to represent the safeguarding of the city and the culture it could be just an added nearby island designed to function as the main port. It could also blend with the Genoa idea where the island is a disconnected portion from the peninsula from the inspiration.

Or the peninsula could be manmade just as the island is. Creating a unique element and providing an unseen before geometric quality to the city planning.
 
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EStoop

Builder
I'd be afraid of Gulltown being too much like White Harbor. That layout seems too similar, imo
I'm conerned about this as well. In Cash's model it seems the layout is similar to that of Whiteharbour. I think placing the city in a bay would make it unique compared to our other towns and cities, with a lot of possibilities to fill in the gaps in canon (Gull tower for example could be located along this bay, outside the city).

I also don't think we should take the layout of a city and apply it to Gulltown; it has an interesting enough canon history to come up with something ourselves. Trying to reflect the growth from a First Men harbour town in a petty kingdom to an Andal city which provides much of the Vale of Arryn with supplies would undoubtedly result in something interesting.

it would be interesting to see the isolationist island Dejima, where Dutch and Chinese ships were allowed to port for much of the seclusion. While it doesn't have to represent the safeguarding of the city and the culture it could be just an added nearby island designed to function as the main port would be a cool idea. It could also blend with the Genoa idea where the island is a disconnected portion from the peninsula from the inspiration.

Or the peninsula could be manmade just as the island is. Creating a unique element and providing an unseen before geometric quality to the city planning.
To be honest I do not see how an island such as Dejima would develop at a place such as Gulltown. Isolationism as there was under the circumstances Dejima was created hasn't occurred throughout the history of the Vale and the Seven Kingdoms on such a scale. However, we could make an island specifically made for quarantine, either manmade or natural.

Isn't there a motherhouse in the bay of Gulltown? Dejima could be good insp
The Motherhouse of Maris is located on a stony island in the city's harbor, which to me implies a natural island.
 
Isolationism as there was under the circumstances Dejima was created hasn't occurred throughout the history of the Vale and the Seven Kingdoms on such a scale. However, we could make an island specifically made for quarantine, either manmade or natural.
Funnily enough there *have* been instances where the Vale has closed off its borders, particularly during the Great Spring Sickness (of which the Vale was unaffected entirely because they closed off port access and road access), so an island made for quarantine could fit in with the Vale's greater history for early detection of sickness.
 

otty

Builder
To be honest I do not see how an island such as Dejima would develop at a place such as Gulltown. Isolationism as there was under the circumstances Dejima was created hasn't occurred throughout the history of the Vale and the Seven Kingdoms on such a scale. However, we could make an island specifically made for quarantine, either manmade or natural.
You've misunderstood, I wasn't suggesting an isolationist port but simply an island off the main shore for ports be, man made or natural.

"it could be just an added nearby island designed to function as the main port."
 
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CashBanks

Maester
I think there’s merit to the Genoa shape, I’m not seeing the immediate similarities to WH beyond being a city on the East side of a body of water.

Anyway, in the alternative, since we’re in the Vale we could explore some options for the city being set on a glacier carved fjord. Something like Queenstown New Zealand.


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Hey,

Since a Runestone redo is being considered as part of the larger Gulltown project and Runestone and Gulltown seem pretty intertwined lore-wise, I was wondering if Runestone's vassals would be affected by this too (and also the placement of them). We know from the books that the Houses Coldwater of Coldwater Burn, Shett of the Gull Tower and Tollett of Grey Glen are sworn to the Royces of Runestone. The name of the Gull Tower probably implies it is either very close to Gulltown or even in the city itself, and thus probably would be affected. The Gulltower is currently just outside of Gulltown itself. Coldwater Burn is canonically within the Northernmost Glacial river of the Snakewood and so I assume it would be too far away from Gulltown/Runestone to fall under its sphere of influence. Grey Glen doesn't have a canon location, but we have placed it in the Northern Vale (in the same valley as Coldwater Burn). To me this seems wierdly (and illogically) far away from Runestone itself, especially since the location isn't canon. Most of the time we place vassal houses fairly close to their liege's lands (as seen with the Frey vassals). This is not necessarily me trying to propose a Grey Glen redo or anything, but I was just wondering what other's thoughts on this are since it seems semi-relevant.
 
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