Block Change Request: Bougainvillea block and vines

[Azulejo]

Request: Bougainvillea block and vines

Request Type: General Addition

Try to describe all workarounds and associated issues that make it necessary to add this block in your eyes.

Bougainvillea is a genre of plants that include vines, bushes and trees originary from South America. They are most known for their flowers, which cover all the plant with beautiful purple, pink or maroon petals. Although they came from the New World, they're widly extended all over the Mediterranea Basin, where are used as ornamental plants and for many have become iconic to the look of the area.

I think they could be a really nice additon to spice up the looks of the southern regions of Westeros: The Arbor, Oldtown and Dorne. I don't think being a plant of the New World should be an impediment, as there are already many on the server (marigolds, jacarandas, pumkins, chiles...). They resist heat quite well, thus making them usable on the irrigated areas of Dorne, where our current rose bushes will likely struggle without intense care. Did I said already they're cute af? Because they are.

Also big castles and palaces are to come on this areas (Arbor castle, Sunspear, the Water Gardens...), buildings whose gardens would greatly benefit from this new plant.​

Types of evidence to support your request: Historical

Historical Evidence

All over the Mediterranean Basin, an area used as inspiration for the south of Westeros, bougainvillea are very present and abundant as decorative plants. One could even justify it was brought by the Rhoynar when they came from the east, and then it spread from there to all the climate suitable areas, due to its beauty and adaptation to the weather. Arbor traders often reach the city of Qarth, another possible source for this plant.

I don't think this is a very urgent request, but it could be very nice if done sometime. In general more colour means richer and more visually interesting builds.​

File(s) attached

 

[FD001__]

Very nice idea!

 

[lemonbear]

Fully support this! I suggested it a while back and got hit with a lot of "but that's a new world plant." I'm from Southern California (where there is a TON of bougainvillea), and it's so pretty. I think it would fit really well in the southernmost (and driest) section of Westeros.

 

[FD001__]

Fully support this! I suggested it a while back and got hit with a lot of "but that's a new world plant." I'm from Southern California (where there is a TON of bougainvillea), and it's so pretty. I think it would fit really well in the southernmost (and driest) section of Westeros.

People forget potatoes are new world originally as well lmao

 

[JaimeLannister]

People forget potatoes are new world originally as well lmao

pumpkins and blueberries are canon too so there's literally no reason to be against new world plants except tomatoes and potatoes, they apparently don't exist.

 

[Margaery_Tyrell]

People forget potatoes are new world originally as well lmao

Potatoes are not in ASoiaf is the difference, theyre mentioned in the Tv show only

tinyurl.com/AsoiafPotatoes

pumpkins and blueberries are canon too so there's literally no reason to be against new world plants except tomatoes and potatoes, they apparently don't exist.

Unless they're mentioned in the canon, there's no reason to believe they're included.

With that logic we have no reason to believe that chocolate, cassava, pineapples, peanuts, vanilla, cacti, tobacco, llamas, hummingbirds etc. aren't also candidates for being added.

 

[FD001__]

Potatoes are not in ASoiaf is the difference, theyre mentioned in the Tv show only

tinyurl.com/AsoiafPotatoes



Unless they're mentioned in the canon, there's no reason to believe they're included.

With that logic we have no reason to believe that chocolate, cassava, pineapples, peanuts, vanilla, cacti, tobacco, llamas, hummingbirds etc. aren't also candidates for being added.

Why see that as a bad thing? afaik not everything on this server is canon - unless you just want everyone to change crops across the whole server, just so potatoes aren't there?

 

[Margaery_Tyrell]

Azulejo

as there are already many on the server (marigolds, jacarandas, pumkins, chiles...).

For flowers those are generic names we placed to replace the old names (Red Flower 13, Red Flower, etc.) which are not indicative of the actual plant they're meant to depict. It's why we use for example cow parsley plant in fields meant to represent fennel or celery.

where our current rose bushes will likely struggle without intense care.

Rosebushes are actually indigenous to Iran and do fine in arid regions and the current largest rose bush in the world grows in the desert of Arizona.

'World's Largest Rosebush' Graces Arizona Desert Town

The bush was planted in 1885 in Tombstone, back when it was a boomtown for silver mining. Blooming season lasts about six weeks — and it's almost always in bloom for Easter Sunday.

www.npr.org

Although they came from the New World, they're widly extended all over the Mediterranea Basin

With most of the New World crops that we have on the server we can usually err, on the side of accepting them in under some general circumstances, chiefly that:

• They're mentioned in canon (blueberries, sunflowers, capsicum peppers, turkeys etc.)
• The time frame they came over we can safely err towards at least being aesthetically close to the time period we're aiming for

Unfortunately bougainvillea plants are not only not mentioned once in canon, they are also a very modern plant, registered only in botanical texts as "bougainvillea" in the 1930s after their discovery in 1790. The prevalence of bougainvillea in warm regions is primarily because they're a cheap plant that can cover up blank spaces really well (which sometimes builders on this server use as a crutch on this server fairly often with our own flowering plants) they really didn't become prevalent as they are now until the 70s and 80s when hybridization efforts were refined

 

[Margaery_Tyrell]

Why see that as a bad thing? afaik not everything on this server is canon - unless you just want everyone to change crops across the whole server, just so potatoes aren't there?

There aren't *any* potatoes on the server *at all* is the difference

 

[Azulejo]

Mmmmm... You've bringed very good points Marge.

It's this additon could become an open gate to more New World plants and animals, something that we need to be aware of (I have thought about that possibility, but I wanted to know what was the general opinion). Honestly I fully belive that all the New World plants that are in ASoIaF are GRRM?S blunders. He simply did not think about them not being available in medieval times.

We could make a generic looking bush with magenta flowers, but as far as I know there are no vines with those tones around the Mediterranean Basin, and roses with such intense coloration might be only possible with intense select breeding. That's the only way I can think of incorporating something like this plant, if that is still a thing we are willing to do.​

 

[Margaery_Tyrell]

Mmmmm... You've bringed very good points Marge.

It's this additon could become an open gate to more New World plants and animals, something that we need to be aware of (I have thought about that possibility, but I wanted to know what was the general opinion). Honestly I fully belive that all the New World plants that are in ASoIaF are GRRM?S blunders. He simply did not think about them not being available in medieval times.

We could make a generic looking bush with magenta flowers, but as far as I know there are no vines with those tones around the Mediterranean Basin, and roses with such intense coloration might be only possible with intense select breeding. That's the only way I can think of incorporating something like this plant, if that is still a thing we are willing to do.​

There are dozens of old-world flowering plants that may also fit the bill in a similar way, jasmine for example, we also have wisteria in Highgarden, clockvines, and some species of honeysuckle. The problem with a lot of plants we're familiar with is that they're generally anachronistic to the medieval period and there are dozens of plants that were common and vital usage that are omitted entirely on our server

 

[RavishMeRed]

I'm all for this addition. My one feedback is that the color adjust may need to be less vivid (strong color intensity) and more saturated (presenting more grey tones of that colors hue) in order to prevent the flora from being too prominent and visually overpowering and taking away from the build.

 

[Azulejo]

For those interested here's a list (in Spanish, but there are pics at the bottom) of plant species cultivated in al-Andalus (islamic Iberia). That could be a start. Of all the most similar would be the adelfa, which is also toxic if ingested (could be used for dornish poisons), but not enough to be a hazard to humans when used ornamentaly. I've mentioned it looong ago in my post about desert plants for Dorne. It would also fit the requirements that Rav has stated, mainly not being as intensly colored. It does not grow as a vine but it can get pretty big, thus being able to peep over the walls of a garden, a look often associated with bougainvillea.

​

 

[FD001__]

There aren't *any* potatoes on the server *at all* is the difference

Wasn't aware, so fair enough.

 

[FD001__]

I think Azuls trying to find the sort of vines/plants he sees in Spain himself, but these plants are after Columbus comes back from America - there isn't really an equivalent for that in ASOIAF (plus Marge has pointed out that new world crops aren't as prominent, maybe with the exception of chillies) so perhaps going for jasmine or some sort of colourful vines maybe a good alternative.

Either way it doesn't matter what they're called, as there could be no visual difference.

 

[Azulejo]

jasmine or some sort of colourful vines maybe a good alternative.

Jasmine is a very important and widly used plant all over the Mediterranean and in muslim coutries, mainly because of its fragance. But we already have jasmine and it only grows in white and yellow. I've edited my response in order to add some similar looking alternatives.

 

[Elduwin]

There are dozens of old-world flowering plants that may also fit the bill in a similar way, jasmine for example, we also have wisteria in Highgarden, clockvines, and some species of honeysuckle. The problem with a lot of plants we're familiar with is that they're generally anachronistic to the medieval period and there are dozens of plants that were common and vital usage that are omitted entirely on our server

Like Marge mentioned, I'd suggest to rather include a specific block for Wisteria (which is originated from Eastern Asia), it would make more sense.

 

[Azulejo]

Wisteria has been sucessfully recreated in Highgarden without the need of a new block, and, altough it thrives in sunny areas, prefers wet soils and climates (it's all over the UK), so it would not fit as well the region bougainvillea can. Also if we are strict with the procedence of plants and their usage in medieval times, wisteria is also a big no. It's from East Asia and Australia, and did not arrived in Europe until the 19th century. I'm more inclined to sustitute bougainvillea with either a generic magenta flower or something like the adelfa.​

 

[AerioOndos]

I'd like to see adelfa and maybe some true myrtle as a shrub or bush though both could potentially be created using our current block set. However, where I think I most support the suggestion of including Honeysuckle due to its rather unique shape, climbing ability and drought tolerance, despite it preferring moist soils (Even gardening australia recommends it).

While not as colourful as bougainvillea it fits similar use while providing practical benefit. Honeysuckle has a number of medicinal uses.

 

[Spikespiegel]

Honestly, if we were to add a new plant, i'd rather have a tall meadow flower ctm. Like tall grass, but which has coloured flowers on top.

I know we have flower ctms already, but I would love some combo between tall grass and small flowers.